Q & A Episode 5 - Keeping Your Clients Happy Through a Long Home Build
Episode #5 | Q&A with Mark D. Williams | Keeping Your Clients Happy Through a Long Home Build
Mark D. Willams shares some stories about keeping his custom home clients happy for a long construction build.
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About The Curious Builder
The host of the Curious Builder Posdast is Mark D. Williams, the founder of Mark D. WIlliams Custom Homes Inc. They are an award-winning Twin Cities-based home builder, creating quality custom homes and remodels — one-of-a-kind dream homes of all styles and scopes. Whether you’re looking to reimagine your current space or start fresh with a new construction, we build homes that reflect how you live your everyday life.
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00:00:29 Minneapolis isn't the the only Market though go to CB usa. uslearn to see if there's an established or upcoming chapter near you that's CB usa. uslearn additionally episode number 26 has an interview with Ryan lipek from cbusa for [Music] more welcome to curious Builder podcast I'm Mark Williams your host today is Thursday which means it's question and answer so this question is a good one and I think we'll probably devote the entire episode just to this question and the question was on high-end homes
00:01:08 between design and build it can last between one to three years how do you keep the clients happy during the build and finish on a high note this is a Whopper of a question and I think it might take an entire career to get everything ironed out so maybe I'll just share some experiences that I've had in the past some things I've learned a few things that I've done uh poorly and kind of even check into where I'm at now maybe I'll start where I'm at now uh actually I'm devoting resources right now to map out an entire client
00:01:45 experience path and so I've done two meetings with my team about this and we actually even hired a consultant to sit in and kind of ask us um you know questions outside the industry because I think building oddly enough for how emotional it is I've spoken about that a lot on the podcast we probably I know I for myself has not spent enough time thinking about the client experience you know we're very or I'm very interested in you know building an incredible home I'm really interested in Cabinetry and
00:02:14 painting and Architects and design and all these amazing things and you need to do that I mean it's you could you can have the best client experience of all time and have a bad product and ultimately that will reflect poorly on the experience you can also have an amazing experience or sorry an amazing product and have terrible client service and you know people keep coming back because your product is so amazing and how great would it be if you were the best at both and it's kind of I'm kind of ashamed to say that it's taken me
00:02:43 about 17 to 18 years to really hit a time out and think what is my client experiencing what are they thinking about because like so many business owners we're thinking about ourselves we're thinking about our craft we're thinking about our home our architect what do we think people would like but I have not not spent enough time thinking about how the client feels and that's probably been a detriment to myself I'm very you know I'm embarrassed that I haven't thought about it sooner um but I'm certainly thinking about a lot now
00:03:11 and some of that has to do with even books you're reading I've spoken about it on the podcast before as well but um I just read um oh um oh Hospitality book I'm blinking on the name of it all of a sudden finished it a month or two unreasonable hospitality and it was all about how to treat people in the restaurant scene and I feel like right now a lot of the book tapes and a lot of the podcasts that I'm listening to uh are outside building because I think that having an injection of some creativity and some what other
00:03:40 Industries other industries that I feel are very successful at this I want to adopt them and bring it into building so right now i' I've kind of charted out the beginning from the first 15minute phone call uh and I do this first 15 minute phone call for me I'm trying to be brief and really to the point I want to respect people's time but I also want to get to The Brass Tack quite quickly are they a good fit uh are they Tire kickers do they just need some direction are they serious and I want to identify
00:04:09 my client as early as possible um I think one of the ways that we can identify our ideal client is just asking straight questions you know I think early on in my career you'd Chase kind of everything like a dog down the street you chase every uh every ball bouncing down the street you get hit by a car but if you can be a little bit more thoughtful in that first interview and I'm not saying you judge a book by its outside cover but you know I think asking pretty direct questions I think it also sets the stage for the client
00:04:35 like this person is a business owner like they get it like they're they know what they want it's a little bit like going to a doctor you know they're asking you pretty straight questions you have to answer those questions if you are unwilling to answer those questions you're probably not a good fit for that Builder or the doctor in this analogy so honestly the client experience starts with clear communication for me um I think one of the things that's important to me is branding so the website Instagram I want that to represent our
00:05:01 brand our build what we care about what we do so a lot of the clients that are reaching out to us are sort of already been pre-qualified by The Branding and the marketing that we're putting out there that honestly is where client experience starts they get a sense of who you are who your team is what your home is and I think that translates it doesn't always have to be words but I think when you really care about what you do and you care about the people who work on the projects with you I think
00:05:28 clients get the sense that you're going to care about them too and I said earlier even in this episode that I didn't spend a lot of time thinking about it I think a good client experience honestly comes down to just one thing I think it's caring it's Integrity it's caring about them as people and so for that standpoint I'm sure I've done a you know okay job of that over the years because I do care about people but I haven't been very thoughtful and intentional about it because I think sometimes it'd be I
00:05:54 think analogous to having Raw Talent versus like working on it I'm sure Michael Jordan uh as we all know is probably one of the best basketball players ever um but he worked tirelessly on his on his um on his jump shot on his free throw I heard a a stat recently that he would end every practice and start every practice with like 100 free throws but it wasn't that he couldn't shoot but that was he was very into his routine and so I think even if we're very talented at thinking about other people and if we're very talented at our
00:06:21 craft we can always spend more time sort of being intentional about it so anyway uh you've got the 15-minute phone call I do a one-hour meeting with my client after that really um giving them time really understanding who they are often give them a um a client gift bag for me I just love merch and I love giving away things to people I love seeing you know their face light up I also like really expensive things so I tend to give them really nice things um you know to me it might be a hydr flask water bottle a canvas bag
00:06:49 that doesn't ever go bad I have clients who've brought their bags back after a decade and like we still use this for groceries or for the kids swimsuit so something that's meaningful something that ref uh you know represents your brand as well so to me I spend a lot of time mainly it's things that I like and soort it's an extension of myself and my company going back to Brand um once you go through the design phase I think a lot of it the design is really the emotional High to me I love the design
00:07:15 phase you know we're interviewing the architect we're interviewing theer designers you start getting into it you know everyone's dreaming big and it's really exciting so there's not much you need to do from a client experience standpoint other than be present and be active because that is really a natural high it'd be like kids opening up their presents on Christmas like it's just it's an exciting time you don't have to try that hard for it to be exciting it just is exciting and then I think once
00:07:38 you're under contract which obviously is the less exciting time talking about pricing um but you can be humorous about it and you can just be very sensitive I often will tell people like I don't need an answer from you today like I'm G to have this meeting with you on a Thursday or Friday so that you have the weekend to sort of decompress take some time to think about it these are you know big monetary decisions and let's let's have this meeting set up already for the following week and talk about it so I
00:08:01 think letting the client know that you realize what they're going through is a is a big purchase it's very expensive um there's a lot of emotion into it and I think too often we get so comfortable with how things cost and what they are that sometimes we can become detached with how they might perceive it or we might get detached of you know what their perception is and I think this also goes back to that first 15minute phone call if you've sort of been prepping them for cost if you've been prepping them during design and
00:08:31 architecture you know kind of just planting Little Seeds of what things are and what they're going to go and just being really honest with people that makes them feel more comfortable because PE I guarantee people are not going to move forward and build a house if they don't feel comfortable um once you get past that for us I have found in the past we used to meet you know whenever clients wanted to meet um we used to maybe not meet as often as as we'd wait for them to initiate with us which is a
00:08:55 big no no now today where I'm at is we keep a bi-weekly meeting going on with our clients so I typically like Tuesdays or Wednesdays and I usually like mornings so we'll usually pick like 9:30 to 10:30 and we'll just have it on our calendars for the entire build so it's kind of funny because I joke with the clients that I'll send them a calendar invite you know and I'll put never in for an end date so it'll fill up their schedule for the next two years three years whatever it is and it's just that
00:09:22 time is protected both on my calendar and their calendar and I and for me personally not every company has to do this but I'm really showing them like this is a commitment both ways this is why we spent so much time in the front end making sure that they were a good fit for us and that they felt they were good with us because it's no joke to meet with someone every you know every two weeks for you know years is a big commitment and it should be enjoyable it doesn't mean that there won't be challenges and then I also try to
00:09:49 respect their time too you know I will try not to bother them with questions or a bunch of random emails I'll try to save up a week's worth of you know content and then give it to him in a nice presentation a nice agenda you know for that meeting so we can be very methodical about it then whatever we don't address gets moved to the next meeting I found this I wish I had done this earlier in my career this is really really helpful I think you can see the clients also relax for a long time in my career we would show up and we would
00:10:17 just ask the client so what's on your mind which I think is fine but I think when if someone isn't demonstrating order if someone isn't demonstrating a clear plan even though we obviously know how to build a home you know you know we know what we're doing I think just showing them a clear like that process that path you can see them visibly react when you hand them the agenda you know for the day uh or and if you can send it to them the day before the night before so they get a chance to look at it you
00:10:44 know some people are better at speaking off the cuff and some need a little time to think about it and so I think understanding who your client is is really really important so those bi-weekly meetings have been amazing clients have loved them and then also telling the client that you know we can cancel the meeting if we don't need to meet you I don't think there's a lot of value in just meeting to meet and so earlier on in the project you of course meet a lot more often towards the middle towards the uh I would say the middle of
00:11:10 the project and the three quarter part you meet less often you know painting might take a month month and a half you know you've already picked the paint colors a lot of the orders are already happening or have already happened so we're just executing on it um you know maybe we are at a I think trim phase is always fun so pretty much everyone always wants to go out and see the cabinets and the trim going in but drywall you know drywall is not super sexy you know maybe it's two to three weeks of drywall depending how big the
00:11:35 house is and you know typically people that want to walk around when people are sanding that dust is in the air so I think just checking in and aligning your schedules with people and then you know we ask our project managers to send out a Friday recap so we use Builder trend for all our scheduling our change orders our documentation our photos I think that's really important too you know we take photos every time we're on the job site post them to Builder Trend and the client gets notified they can pop in
00:11:59 there see all their site photos from their PM they can add photos if they want it's also a great way for them at the end of the job they can download all the photos and kind of see a time lapse of their entire home and photos they may not at the time they may be so busy thinking about making the selections on granite or cords countertops or tile or whatever they're picking out but at the end to realize they can look back and have every single picture on their home uh I think it's a little bit like I have
00:12:23 young kids is taking pictures of your kids in the moment and then a couple years later you look back and you're like oh man I remember that moment that was great so there is some Nostalgia about that it also allows them to share additionally it's super helpful you know one year two years 10 years 20 years down the road you know if they're doing a remodel on their home or they sell the home to somebody they can give them all those pictures that they had and a future remodeler or us if we're still
00:12:47 around you know we can look and say hey that wall had a bunch of speakers in it or there's a bunch of wires here and is very helpful for essentially uh future proofing the house in terms of you know remodeling information versus you know opening up a wall and wondering what's there so I think those um those photos and those Friday Recaps so every Friday it doesn't have to be a lot and the RPM will just enter in a little uh daily log note and just say hey this week you know we had drywall on on um on the schedule
00:13:17 you probably saw that you know we had one day where some people we had a you know another job going they had to pull off for a half day you know or you know we had some issue come up and this is how we dealt with it and then we also have a look forward so next week we have a meeting with the landscaper and so really it's just kind of a weekly report card I think our clients probably I would have to imagine they like that more than anything it's just a nice little pulse check especially if you have a client that is uh out of towerer
00:13:44 oh man these uh weekly updates are extremely extremely helpful Lake Society magazine is minneapolis's Premier target market Boutique lifestyle and design publication it embodies the unique Lifestyles and design of the Minneapolis City Lakes neighborhoods from Lake of the Isles to Lake Harriet it showcases the best in local design projects by both Premier Builders Architects and interior designers in this area Lake Society magazine has the look and feel of a national publication with glossy covers high-end finishes it's mailed
00:14:12 directly to Upper bracket single family homeowners in the city Lakes area and it's the perfect local coffee tabletop publication subscriptions can also be available through the website lak Society magazine.com additionally publisher and founder Karen stle has over 27 years in a local magazine publishing industry and has a passion for high-end photography and quality Graphics her commitment to Quality visual Simplicity and Beauty are strongly reflected in her beautiful Lake Society magazine then I would say this
00:14:43 was advice that actually Brad levit gave me from afd construction and I've I've done it well I've done it probably five or six times and I'm going to change it a little bit but his core message was super impactful for me and his comment was is you know you're building a house for several years and and we get so used to meeting on the job site meeting at our office you know meeting meeting meeting meeting but what about just a timeout in the middle to go have a meaningful meal together don't even talk
00:15:09 about the house if you don't want to it likely will come up but just share a meal together I think it's a great you know bonding experience just for your team so it' be the project managers um husband and wives can obviously come depending on who wants to be there and you just have a sit down we did one uh last year uh right around maybe a month before Christmas and it was great we had two project managers our project coordinator we had the clients we had the designers a pretty big meal on that
00:15:33 particular one we had 10 12 people and the clients talked about it for about three four months after they loved it now for me personally with young kids night times tend to be pretty tough uh and I know Mrs Williams is not a big fan of that so I think I'm going to be switching that to brunch or lunch because it's something I can control in the middle of the day and so I'm going to try that going forward here that if I'm on a multi-year project maybe once every six months I'll just ask the client if they want to go have cup of
00:15:59 coffee or you know I love breakfast burritos for whatever reason so uh maybe I'll take them to my favorite breakfast spot you know sit down with a team uh and just have a meal together I think that is it it just also demonstrates we're all human we all have lives and I think the best projects looking back are the ones where things have really been humanized when you realize that you know you have a hardworking team trying to build an amazing home or amazing remodel for the client and the client also sees
00:16:26 that as well plus it allows you just to understand like what's going on in their life live so I I don't see any downside to this it's really really uh it's also very meaningful and I look back at in past years of um times that we've done this or we've even done at the end of a job uh we could talk a little bit about this but it has to do with meals so I'll bring it up now where a client threw us a thank you party and they brought a food truck and they brought the whole team it was really gracious of them they
00:16:51 brought um I think we had 340 people landscape electricians and they just wanted to say thank you to everybody that had helped that's actually only happened once and that was a beautiful client and such an amazing time and I look back at that very fondly of what a what a wonderful thing that was and how appreciative that client was of the team that had helped her and that was that was just beautiful I wish more clients it's not like I can suggest that to my client like by the way if you have a great build we'd really appreciate you
00:17:17 throwing us a party because we actually earlier in my career I switched this around I used to um when people were done I would say you know two months after they were in I would ask them if we could host party at their home and I did it for two reasons I heard this actually this was how a real estate agent early in her career um started her career and how she broaden her network but she would you know put on the dinner she'd cater the meal uh and then the homeowner could invite you know 15 20 of
00:17:45 their friends and the Builder could invite you know one or two of maybe their prospects or someone on their team and you just have a meal at their home and that was great I I would still be very much open to that it's very personal and I love that for whatever reason the last six or seven years I've brought it up to a number of clients and I've never had a client say yes to it other than the one who threw us the party and I think just people have gotten so busy that they I don't think they want to do it and so I want to
00:18:14 respect that so maybe um wherever you're building across the United States maybe this is something that would be more approachable for you I did really enjoy it I I've met some future clients at uh some of these and also was just not everything has to be about business it was also just a really nice gesture from our team to theirs you know let's let's let's make a meal uh let's bring in a meal in the home that we help create for you and share it together I I think it's just a nice Personal Touch if you can do
00:18:38 it um another client experience pathway milestone for me is probably towards the end you know people are starting to get you know they're tired they're excited to they're either really excited to move into their house or they're really tired of the process and they want to move into their house either way they want to be in their house so I think knowing I've talked about this previously as well that making sure that you're punch list and your movein date are well aligned so they're not um they're not at odds with
00:19:03 each other um this has taken me a long time to understand unfortunately and I'm only now currently uh in my contracts do I have it written this way where uh I need 30 days from the time that we do our final walkthrough and I won't do our final walkthr till we have the certificate of occupancy from the city so the CEO which normally you it seems like the home owners would like to move in like the next day but it's now it's written in my contract so this goes back to clear communication I've told them a
00:19:30 year two years ahead of time so they're not really bringing it up it's been on the schedule it says right in Builder Trend 30-day buffer like there there's they've known about this date forever and the reason I know that this is a better way than what we've done before is inevitably the way we used to do it is we would do our our punch list we would have five days to we do it on a Monday and they would move in on a Friday afternoon well four and a half days is just not enough time to do whatever is on this punch list clean the
00:20:00 house have it staged have it ready and for them to have a successful move in on Friday so then what happens is is you're not quite done uh they move into the house they feel dissatisfied because they were to rushed to get in they've obviously had an exhausting weekend they've probably noticed 15 20 things that they wish could have been done or new things or maybe they dinged up the walls and then it goes on another list and then here's the real here's the real kicker now they're in the home getting
00:20:26 our trade Partners to work on a client's home while they live in it plus you know navigate to their schedule some homeowners are more open to letting people come in than others is honestly you'd have better luck uh winning the lottery it is really tough so uh we had another Builder on our previous episode uh Sven gusson from Stonewood said you know you could probably add four to six months to your project I believe that we had one last year good personal friend of mine she had some extenuating circumstances and we let her move in
00:20:56 quote early and we were on unhappy she was unhappy we're a year later and now her punch list has really just morphed into her one-year call back list and so I wish I had known this information ahead of time because I think she would have been much happier waiting 30 days and so I think as as Builders as remodelers as people in charge of our client's experience sometimes it's e it's hard to say no that first time and disappoint them but you know kind of my new line is I'd rather disappoint you once than disappoint you a hundred times
00:21:26 and so all we can do is learn and and uh from other builders that's what I've learned from uh I've learned this firsthand and so now going forward I'm really excited to see uh we're actually coming up on our first uh 30-day full punch list here this uh October so uh I'm sure I'll talk about it on the podcast I'm really excited about it um then at the end so the client now has moved in you know maybe we've done a closing gift I like to do something pretty personal I think this is hard sometimes you like you know to I've
00:21:56 given gifts that reflect something about me personally and then it's sentimental I give it to them sometimes I try to give them you know something that I think I've maybe I've heard them talk about during you know the build uh we had a client where she was really into you know she loved her family and she wanted a w water color so I actually um the interior designer had come to me about six months before the end and she said would you go in with me on this gift we have a portrait of their family
00:22:25 and we'd like to hire this watercolor artist to give this to them as a gift it wasn't it was very expensive but it was such a meaningful token of our appreciation of this client and oddly enough this was the same client that you know threw us a party at the end so the love went both ways for sure and so anyway it doesn't have to be a grand gesture like that it could be something you know simple uh I've given clients uh during the build I've given them massage uh tickets to or not tickets um you know
00:22:54 uh bookings or coupon sorry for like a local um you know Spa you know go go go take a day to relax and you know get a massage who doesn't like a good massage and um so things like that find something that is Meaningful to you and find a way to give it to them that shows that you care about them that you're thoughtful could be something to do with their kids maybe it's maybe one of their kids is on a sports team maybe you donate to you know their their sports team uh I remember another Builder used
00:23:21 to make really um highly colored shirts and he would give them to the client's kids and you know my little kids are constantly wearing little Mark Williams custom home shirts running around the house uh that's like their nighty shirts and uh and then I as I became app parent I saw this I'm like wow that was a genius move by that Builder because you know the parents often won't wear you know t-shirts um but then again they didn't have Harish work wear making their t-shirts shout out to them uh but
00:23:47 so the little kids would be running around with their branded logo and their you know their sports teams things like that so I think look for opportunities to show your clients that you care um I think also um you know whether it's i' I've I've sent my ticket or I've sent my clients you know we have season tickets to the wild local hockey team here in Minnesota so sometimes I'll take them to a game or you know sometimes you don't have to go with them sometimes not that you don't want to but sometimes it's
00:24:12 more meaningful if you have a family of four you know send their family to a game or an experience and I know that I've had um people trying to get our business before and again just because I'm busy at nights with uh small children um I have found that the most meaningful gifts are people that have really known that I have small kids I've gotten like Disney on Ice tickets I've gotten um you know little kid Festival things and I'm like I actually go because it's something I can bring all my kids to um you know my lawyer Steve
00:24:41 Yak his wife started the Aurora or helped start the Aurora girls soccer team here in Minnesota and every year you know I take all the kids to a the girls soccer game I have a my oldest is a daughter and and uh plus it's just a great atmosphere and so that's really thoughtful of Steve to do that and um I just think it shows uh how you care about other people I think uh also maybe towards um this client experience thing like you know you're going to have holidays you know if you're building for two three years you know understanding
00:25:09 that people are going to have vacations people are going to have birthdays people are going to have they need some time and sometimes you need a break from the project so usually uh during Christmas um and during the the month of the Fourth of July the beginning of July we'll give our team a week off on both of those and we let our clients know ahead of time so that they're not stressed about it but we also want them to know like hey if you're on vacation we're not going to bother you like you need a chance to decompress and um you
00:25:36 know get away from all the decision-making if you will um and so does our team too and I think when you are humanizing what you're doing it does make them more bonded to you and again this is not some ploy to it's just a way of communicating to the client so that their experience is a positive one letting them know ahead of time and then I think just be organized you know have a clear your line of communication you know whether it's we often give our clients an intake form do they like to be communicated via email phone uh I
00:26:07 don't actually put text as an option so it's pretty much inperson email or phone or virtual I guess now we have some clients that prefer virtual but texting is not one of the options that I give the clients and part of the reason is is it's my own bias against texting I'm fine with texting say like hey I'm going to be late to a meeting or hey you're on the job site and you send them a cool video or cool photo because it you know our phones now are amazing at video but I don't want both for their sake and for
00:26:35 our sake if they're working I don't want to be bothering them by it by a texting and the dinging all the time like I can send them an email and I can respect whatever boundary they have in place and then by doing so they hopefully will reflect that back to us as well and I've had a few clients over the years that have not been able to respect you know uh kind of the no texting and that's a real problem and you remind them over and over and over again that this is just not how you communicate as a
00:27:01 business we actually have it written right in our contract we're happy to announce that on August 1st Mark Williams Custom Homes and the joy collaborative are holding a charitable event at one of our past Builds on Medicine Lake if you're interested in raising money to help out children with disabilities there's over 66,000 Kids in Need in Minnesota alone we'd love for you to attend details can be found on our website the Cur Builder podcast.com or any of our social channels we hope to see you there additionally if you want
00:27:29 to hear more about the joy collaborative please listen to Episode 34 on the curus Builder podcast we're excited to announce that we've opened up another curious Collective for the last year we've had the Curious Builder Collective we now have the Curious Builder Collective for designers the first ones will be happening in September all the details are going to be on our website we have 30 spots available half of them have already filled We additionally have eight spots left in the Builder Collective if you're interested in
00:27:55 getting together in small groups of nine with local Minneapolis based Builders and designers in separate groups and talking about your business talking about your Brands asking those questions that you wish you could ask another business owner then this is the place for you details can be found at the curiousb Builder podcast.com and so I guess this goes back to the the main point that I'm trying to bring up here just clear expectations with your clients I think of you know some wonderful restaurants I mean you see the
00:28:23 menu they almost tell you what's going to happen you know the Mator sits you down at the table they give you a little welcome gift um so anyway I'm I'm still not done with creating this path I think this is a phenomenal question and um anyway hopefully there's something in here that you can apply to your business uh we'll see you next week for [Music] Q&A thanks for listening to the cures Builder podcast if you like what you listen to please give us a five-star rating and write us a review it really
00:28:49 means a lot it's a great way for us to just understand what you like about the podcast and what we can keep doing so like and review and please share with your friends and family find out more at curious Builder podcast.com [Music]
