Episode 111 - From Fine Dining to Floor Plans: A Second Act with Heart
#111 | Angela and David Pencsak | Pencsak Builders | From Fine Dining to Floor Plans: A Second Act with Heart
Ever wonder how food photography and French restaurants lead to luxury custom homes? Angela and David Pencsak spill the story of how their creative, entrepreneurial paths converged into Pencsak Design. From their Parade of Homes sweep to launching a concierge service and giving back through a veteran home project, they cover it all—with a lot of laughs, real talk, and heart.
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About Pencsak Builders LLC
Pencsak Builders is owned and operated by David and Angela Pencsak. David Pencsak discovered his love for building during his 30 years of designing, building and owning restaurants. Angela Pencsak brings an artistic flair to the custom home building industry. She assists clients throughout the design process as the head interior designer. Angela is also a master photographer, having owned and operated a professional photography studio in the San Antonio area for over 13 years, and winning the coveted “San Antonio Photographer of the Year” award four years in a row. Since 2012, David and Angela have worked together, successfully leading a dynamic home building team in San Antonio and the Texas Hill Country.
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Angela Pencsak 00:00
I think it saves them money doing that, because you're gonna make less mistakes. We're gonna, you know, really have our eyes on that plan, making sure that every door swing is, you know, the right way that you know where a pocket door needs to be, all these things that you know, we help them through that. I just feel like it ends up being so much better than just someone coming to us with plans. Like, here I have plans. And like, can you build this?
Mark D. Williams 00:38
Today? In the podcast, we had Angela and David pensack, builders out of Texas. And we had a great interview. It was really fun to hear David's story. You know, he was a entrepreneur at an early age, wanting to start his own business, built hotels, restaurants, bounced back and forth. Angela had a really cool business as well, having a professional photography business for 13 years. And so just talking about their journey, how they met, how they got into building homes, you're gonna hear it all in this podcast episode. So without further ado, here's Angela and David. Welcome to curious builder Podcast. I'm Mark Williams, your host today. I'm joined with Angela and David penzak. From what I didn't actually, I was thinking of Texas and like San Antonio, but you actually, you're not in San Antonio. No,
Angela Pencsak 01:18
we're actually in garden Ridge, but we build in San Antonio and the surrounding hill country. So I looked
Mark D. Williams 01:22
at your list of all the places you build. I mean, I would need, like, a Rand McNally map to like, I don't know the state of Texas very well, other than the big cities, but it's like, basically New Braunfels. No, oh yeah. Other than it's all over your website.
David Pencsak 01:36
It's an old German town, uh huh. But it's just a really great town and a lot of entertainment, good restaurants. How long have
Mark D. Williams 01:44
you guys had lived there?
Angela Pencsak 01:48
Oh, well, I'm from San Antonio. I was born and raised here, but we've lived here for 12 years, no 13 years. Well,
David Pencsak 01:55
yeah, we lived in this house for 13 years, but you were here for your whole life, on and off. And then I got here about five or six years before that.
Mark D. Williams 02:05
I'm a military brat, all right, so we'll dive all into that. I wanted to bring you guys on. We've been friends for three years. It was three years ago almost to the week in May where we both met. We went to the contractor coalition, the inaugural one in Nashville. And you know, we stay in touch. And now you guys are leading one of our curious builder collectives, which is really cool. And I just, I was commenting this morning, actually, I called Morgan Molitor on the way in, because she was one of the three principles for and she didn't answer, but I left her a video of just like, how small the world has gotten. And basically, if you're not an alumni at this point of contractor coalition, like, hurry up and join the club, because the team is pretty great. I
Angela Pencsak 02:43
know you guys are our family.
David Pencsak 02:44
I do have a memory of that first contractor coalition that Who's that guy up there asking 100 questions. You were on it, man, I love it. I didn't even need to come prepared.
Angela Pencsak 03:00
No, you know it's funny. He goes, Oh, he must be a brand new builder, like, doesn't know anything. And then he looked you because, Oh no, he's not.
Mark D. Williams 03:09
That's funny. Turns out it's not a brand new builder, but he doesn't know anything. So you're 5050, on that one. David, you know what's funny is I people comment on that all the time, even before I knew because that was before I started the curious brother podcast. That was about six or eight months before I started it, because that was in May, and I started the podcast in September of that year. Brad Levitt brought me on his podcast after meeting him at the contractor Coalition for the first time. And I was like, wow, people get to talk to each other. It's like therapy that you don't pay for, although, actually, no, I probably start mine soon, right? I mean, it's therapy on air, and everyone gets to listen to it. But what's interesting is just realizing how small your community is, and that, what I took away from it is that no matter what city in the country you're from, as an owner entrepreneur, we all struggle with the exact same issues, and so by talking about them, we elevate as a community. And that's really the power of the podcast world, and really the tight knit world of builders. I think it applies to anybody, but I feel like it's such a needed, a needed thing in our industry, and so it's been great to watch it that
Angela Pencsak 04:08
you started the collective, because even our first meeting was so successful, and I learned so much from the other builders as well. We
Mark D. Williams 04:17
started the collective here. So it was a year ago that we started the curious builder collective, and what it was meant to be, as you well know, but for the audience, if they don't know what it is, is it lives between a builder 20 group and a the contractor Coalition, which is three days. Builder 20s meet twice a year for two days, and it was something light fast, just a way to speed up the whole process. Maybe people don't want to spend the money, or don't have the time to travel around the country for multiple days at a time, and so the cures builder collectives were formed basically to be three four hour meetings four times a year in a local community and really empower I think Morgan talked about it all the time, and she believes it now has become my bumper sticker on life is collaboration over competition. And I feel. So, and I feel like you're not saying that, like the world is too small. There's so much open information everywhere, and so the idea that someone would know something that's like the old guard would historically think I know something they don't, so I'm not going to share it, because that's my competitive advantage. But honestly, don't you feel like that's kind of archaic thinking, because the world is so far beyond that, that if you still believe that like you're just going to be left behind,
Angela Pencsak 05:23
right? I do. I think I'm always asking questions. I must be like, You mark a little bit, because I'm always texting other builders, asking them different questions. And I think I just asked the other day, has anyone put one of those faux tile roofs on? I haven't used that product before, and I got like six different answers from six completely different builders. So, yeah. So
David Pencsak 05:46
all of the different contractor coalition, we belong to CB USA. So that's a whole nother group of builders. We have 25 builders in the San Antonio. I think we have the biggest one and biggest one, yeah, and you can ask any question on there, and everybody helps everybody.
Mark D. Williams 06:03
I think that. I think the idea is that obviously we don't know all the answers. In fact, I use it as a selling point. Most people are not attracted to somebody that says I know everything. Like, I can't. I don't know if anyone is unless it was, maybe I will say this, like, if my heart surgeon is like, you know what, the middle of your heart surgery, I'm gonna have to ask a few questions. Maybe Google it. I'm like, you know, I actually wish you'd do all the answers on this particular one. But like, I think it shows humility, which most people would. I think we have a hard time maybe having humility, and it's like a learn process, but we certainly admire it when we see it. And I think we're drawn to people that have that that that humble knowledge, yeah, and I think it's maybe, it's a maybe it's authentic and being really approachable like I think that's why maybe, as you get older, you're more comfortable with who you are, so you're more comfortable with sharing what you have, because you're not you don't feel threatened. And so if anything, you this community sort of empowers you, and the more you share, the better you feel, the better they feel. It's kind of like this circle of winning. I mean, really, it's just that. It just it keeps feeling better and better, and as people's friends ships grow and like, why can't you ask questions? Like, the other day, I had a we're using zip our 12 on our upcoming Misa, who's project our spectrum. They use an R, yeah. And so we've, we actually been doing zip r6 for a couple years now, and I love it. It's very simple. The rigid foam is built right into it, pushing that thermal envelope to the outside. In our climate, we're in climate zone five and six, so it's pretty cold up here, but even in a hot climate, obviously it's going to keep you cool better, too. And so we're going, we're doubling that, we're going to an R 12. And I just no one in our market has done it before. And when I was talking to the manufacturer, they said, Hey, why don't you call this builder up in Massachusetts? And I feel bad I can't pull his name off the top my head right now, but I called him, and he gave me, like, 25 minutes of his time. He was more than happy to say, Hey, this is how we this is how we did it. This is what I recommend. And he said, hey, when you're installing it, if you have any questions, give me a call. And that's the type of world we live in. When you ask for help, you get it. And so that part's really cool,
Angela Pencsak 08:03
yes, yeah. And the contract coalition group, we're we all share so much. I love that about this group,
Mark D. Williams 08:10
builder 20s, have you sign NDAs and I get it like you're sharing, like your all your financials, your but the contractor coalition, that was Brad Nick and Morgan saying, Here's everything we've got. Take anything you want, repurpose it, reuse it. And I think seeing that you had these really high end builders that are very well known, say, Take anything you want, I think it makes you more open, too. I was always an open person, but now I'm even more open than I was before. Would you agree?
Angela Pencsak 08:36
Yes, absolutely for sure.
David Pencsak 08:39
I feel we are too, with all the different groups, it just and they intertwine too, and it's just everybody just shares. And I think it's because we're willing to share too our experiences. Yeah, all the time. It's good. What did you
Mark D. Williams 08:54
guys notice? So you guys just had your first collective just a few weeks ago, and it usually takes about six months to a year to get a big group together. And I'm like, it's less about the number and it's more about what is discussed. What was your experience? I actually haven't talked to you. I mean, I talked to you the day after
Angela Pencsak 09:09
the day we had it, it was pouring down rain. I was like, Oh my gosh, is everyone gonna not come now? And it did. Some of them. It took an hour to get there, but, oh, it was just great. It's we sat around, and it was like every it's the best things. When you go to IBS and you're and you get to socialize with builders you haven't seen in a long time, it's like, all the good stuff. All right, in one we just, we sat in the room. We had it at the Pella showroom, and we sat in this executive type of room. It was a long table with, I don't know, 12 chairs or something, and we just, I was, I loved it, because you have already prepared all these topics for us. So I just went down the row, and it brought up conversation. And we would get stuck on one question and not even make it to the next, and start talking about stuff. And then I would go down, I'm like, oh yeah, we already talked about that. So it's really. Have guided. You guys have helped us to guide the whole thing too. So it's never like a dull moment of talking.
Mark D. Williams 10:07
Yeah, part of it is just everyone. Angela, you and I are don't have a problem, David, either, with talking. And so that is not everyone in the group is an Uber communicator. And so you want to create a space that people feel safe and they feel like they can share. And part of the as the groups get bigger, we break into small groups of nine, and I'm a non builder group here in Minnesota called coalition nine. And Aaron Eggert, the guy who created it, actually based the number. He's obsessed with nine. We had a whole episode just on the power of nine, but I didn't know this that you mentioned you're a military brat. The military squad is based on nine, and the concept in the group is that it's big enough to have, if there's a few quiet people, there's enough people that could carry conversation, but it's also small enough that it can be nimble and redirect. And one thing that is so fun about the smaller groups is the ability to ask questions. And there's a lot of times where the questions are they're just there for prompts. But also you, and you have to use a single question if you didn't want to. They're really just,
Angela Pencsak 10:59
I just want to tell you they were great though. I really enjoyed having that, you know. And
David Pencsak 11:04
ours was about financing and banking. The first one we did, and I invited a guy with a that worked for a bank here that I've done business with. So he came. He was great. He was great. So it's and I think of it about when I talked to him that, hey, you should come and you get to be in front of a bunch of builders. These are opportunities for you as a bank, and then it's an opportunity for the people to ask you the questions too. And they and they did in current market stuff and what's happening, and what do you see happening the rest of the year. So he was just and then I told him, he thanked us for inviting him after and I said, Look, sign up, come to every one of them and hang out so that he has the opportunity the people in our group have the opportunity to make a connection to as we get bigger. It was really good. What diving back
Mark D. Williams 12:00
a little bit, just because there are many people that don't know you and I was you, had you guys been building since 2012 is that correct?
Angela Pencsak 12:08
Yeah, I have Dave's been building a lot longer than me. When he built restaurants. Yeah, that's that was new
Mark D. Williams 12:14
to me. I mean, I'd love to hear about the David. So it said you, you built for 30 years, designed and built restaurants like I how I've known you for three years. I had no idea that this is a past life of David. Like, yeah. Like, how? You got to tell me more about this.
David Pencsak 12:26
So I yeah, I actually changed directions while I was I went to Texas Tech, and my original major was land man, so have you seen the movie out or the show
Angela Pencsak 12:37
called land series? Land man, oh, God, you gotta watch your
David Pencsak 12:41
foot anyway. So that's the job I was gonna I was a geologist, basically. And then you go out and you negotiate land deals with people that had oil and stuff like that. So Wow. Okay, then I started looking at rocks and all structures like that. I go, this really bores me. And they started the program, hotel, restaurant and institutional management at Tech, and that's what I ended up graduating with. And I got really lucky. My first job out of school was four season hotels. The still to this day, probably the best training I ever had. They're just such a first class group and and then I moved up there a little bit. And then I went to my food and beverage director and said, Hey, he goes, Look, I really don't have any more for your skill set. And I was young, right? My first think about this, my income was $16,000
Mark D. Williams 13:37
were you and your teens, or were you in your young 20s? Young 20s, yeah, and then
David Pencsak 13:43
he hooked me up with a guy that was doing a country French restaurant, single owner, if, and also if I knew, then what a bottle of Patrice would be worth I would have, I kind of buy the cases.
Mark D. Williams 13:53
One of my, one of my obsessions last year, was the book unreasonable hospitality, and it was about a restaurant in New York, and anyway, you brought up the four seasons. I'm just curious, have you ever thought about that? Now, in turn, I feel like building is ripe for a huge moment in hospitality. We're in people's homes, and I think if you were to pull the average client as a builder too, it's something we need to level up our business as well, because building a home is so intimate, and I've talked a lot about it on the podcast. But do you feel like some of your time at the Four Seasons, because I would there are really elite hotel Do you feel like you've been able to apply some of the hospitality, or were you more on the construction side of things?
David Pencsak 14:32
I think I always had the hospitality thing. It was natural for me. I was like social chairman for a fraternity. So, I mean, at Tech and I was it was really easy for me to talk to people, so I think that worked well for me in that business. And then the real takeaway from me, from four seasons, which is important for our business now, is the amount of training that they did and the courses they gave, and how much time they really spent with you. But ultimately, I was wanting to go faster than what the framework of four seasons was going to take me at, because there's just so many people that work there that were really good, right? And so my food and beverage director at the time just goes, Hey, I got this guy. He's has a restaurant. He needs someone to run his restaurant from him. And that's when I went from the hotel to, like, single standing restaurant, and it was a country, French place with a wine cellar downstairs. So I learned all about wine and that, and then that wasn't still good enough. So then I went and opened a hotel. Was Was it
Mark D. Williams 15:35
just, was it the pace? I love your curious mind here. What was it that wasn't fulfilling that you Was it because you weren't the owner what? Yeah,
David Pencsak 15:41
it was the owner part that I was always striving for. Did you
Mark D. Williams 15:45
know that at the time, or were you just restless? I wanted to always knew,
Angela Pencsak 15:49
Oh my gosh, yes. He would ask for equity in every business, yeah. So there's, yeah, that's and he made when we got married, he kept, I think we're serial entrepreneurs. He was like, Oh, we're going to open this, because we sold these. We have these plates, right? And these white plates, like, hey, I can get these plates for us, and we could open. So we were opening, and I had my photography studio at the time. It was called the white plate and company, and we made a logo, and then it was so hard to photograph white plates, I mean, really? So I did this whole thing and, well, that was a big fail. Oh yeah, that's one of your fails. I'm like, remember? I was like, remember the white plate company that we opened? Oh my gosh, why? Why did it? Why did it fail restaurants? Because we just thought our plates were so cool, right? Were
Mark D. Williams 16:37
they too expensive, or you just couldn't market them, or never even
David Pencsak 16:41
it was really more of an online marketing and we, between the just didn't have that skill set, and we were still busy with our other job, so it just didn't go you know, what's
Mark D. Williams 16:52
interesting, I think especially as you get older and you hit, I don't want to call it midlife crisis. After a while, you get either burned out, or you have the restless mind. You feel like you need something like a new something new, and it could be new within construction, right? You could go into a spec home building. You could maybe only build two stories, and you want to build villas. Or there's so many different avenues within building, but I remember somebody, and I'm sure there's a better saying than this, but basically at some point you have to put like the Budweiser horses with a correct with the focuses on the blinders on the side. Is like staying focused on being successful is probably not getting distracted. Sometimes people get bored with success, and I've never been successful enough to get bored with it, but I certainly have been just bored. And I feel like a lot of entrepreneurs probably struggle with this. I know I do. I'm constantly I joke that between Monday and Wednesday I come up with 15 businesses, and by Friday, I've got to shoot them all down, or I'm going to start them all because I think I had problems. I mean, don't you think the vision side of it, division and the drive is what makes entrepreneurs successful? And you've been in business for 13 years, so you are successful by that definition of a loan. But then the real challenge is, how do you innovate without sort of alienating like what you're good at, and I've struggled with this mightily, because you get distracted by something that's new and shiny. And it doesn't mean it shouldn't be worth your attention, but if you were truly gonna make money on it, you dial down right now. For those that aren't watching, Dave is just pointing at Angela.
Angela Pencsak 18:16
He's even like that with the beginning of a build a slab pour. I think he gets so excited the night before, like a kid waiting for Santa and he's a slap or tomorrow, literally, 6am and he's just and then that's what you're excited about. Then when it comes to the punch list at the end,
Mark D. Williams 18:32
that no one's excited about that one. Yeah,
David Pencsak 18:36
I dislike punch so bad. Oh, Dick's the one I fired
Angela Pencsak 18:40
him from that like our daughter came to work for us and like she's, she's going to be the punch. So
Mark D. Williams 18:46
I derailed us. I apologize. So David, you before you started the white plate company and you were married, we'll go back to how you guys met, because I think that sounds like it could be an interesting story. Your wife. You know, you left four seasons? No,
David Pencsak 18:57
I left. Okay, so just real quick, Ian, I'll go through it really quick. Left four seasons to go work. Yeah, we don't have three hours country French restaurant. Then left there to open a hotel. So I was in charge of fine dining, the restaurant, room service. So that was a pretty good push as far as management goes. Instead of just being a single manager walking around a restaurant, then I wanted the food and beverage director's job, and I was still young, right? I mean, the other person that was competing for it was 15 years older than me and had a ton of experience, but I was kind of pissed I didn't get the job, so I took another job, and back to the single standing restaurants. And that's just kind of it was from that point on till I just totally moved over to the building business, custom home building business was all restaurants, different concepts, and you
Angela Pencsak 19:52
skipped like, all those years of restaurants like that hit. But
David Pencsak 19:55
I'm just saying, like, we had like eight podcasts. We're gonna make it 10 hours, because no. You're taking forever to even tell the
Angela Pencsak 20:01
story. Okay, this
Mark D. Williams 20:02
is great. This is going to be a multi series. Don't worry. Netflix will be calling. They want the whole story. I'm just
Speaker 1 20:07
very mild for us, okay, very mild. Yeah, we always
Angela Pencsak 20:10
tell our clients like you might be uncomfortable in front of us sometimes, but we're Mr. And Mrs. Biggerson.
Mark D. Williams 20:22
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Angela Pencsak 21:02
Well, okay, so I'm gonna tell that story, and I'll try to be quick. So you start with your history. He was already, like, had restaurants for many years, and he was so there's a new restaurant was opening up, and he was building it down the street. And I had just opened my photography studio, which I had for 14 years. I was a professional photographer, and I did all the things. I was like, president of our association on the board, and I taught nationally all kinds of things like that. Career was so fun. Anyway, he I went into the restaurant, and I was like, Oh, hey, I'm your new neighbor. I have a photography studio down the street. And then he was like, Oh, do you photograph food? And I'm like, Well, no, not really, because I was specializing in newborns and maternity and kids and stuff and but I was like, I can't try. And he goes, Okay, he was too cheap to want to pay. He was like, Can we do a trade? And I'm thinking, like, what are you gonna give me a combo plate? Like, I'm expensive, you know. So I was, like, insulted, but I go, okay, look, here's what you can do. I'm gonna have a grand opening and I'm gonna have a grand opening party. You can cater the whole party. So that's what he did.
Mark D. Williams 22:09
Oh, okay, I like it. Look at you guys. I love that. You guys met bartering, and
Angela Pencsak 22:13
I was and we're, like, we're a blended family. He had two kids. I have two kids. We were both married before, so we had to come together. So hence why, when we got married, we had to build our own house. Well, he already knew how to build so I'm, like, not a big deal, right? We'll build this 5600 square foot
David Pencsak 22:31
house. Like, No, her budget was 4000 square feet. Well, this is this. I
Angela Pencsak 22:36
had to have a Christmas closet, but so yeah, we built a five bedroom house, and I think seven bathrooms, and we were just, it went crazy. Well, he was in Dallas building another restaurant, and so I had to be the project manager, and I really didn't know anything about building. And so there was many times I was in the car crying, like literally crying, because he was like, I don't like the way that Stonewall is you need to go tell him to tear it down. And I was like, what? I don't want to go tell him to tear it down. Well, it started off with like, I should see me today. I'm like, Oh no,
David Pencsak 23:09
no, but she has no problem now. Yeah, just
Mark D. Williams 23:15
so was it during that build, Angela like, at what? Like during that process, when did you discover that you either had a talent or that's what you guys wanted to do together.
Angela Pencsak 23:22
No, no, that wasn't during that we built the house. We did great, probably one of the best houses. Still, it was like our first luxury residential home. I built
David Pencsak 23:33
it for $110 a foot. That's how long ago. This is great. Of course, there was no margin added to it because we were the builder, but Right? I mean, yeah,
Angela Pencsak 23:45
crazy, crazy. So anyway, no, I still have my studio, and I was still thriving on that, and loved it. And because I'm an artist and I have to create, I have to create things, create things. So we actually didn't really start our business right after what we did was we, we started off doing a couple specs, and we just really loved it
Mark D. Williams 24:05
basically on the side. So at this point, because I think
David Pencsak 24:09
I was an owner, I could do whatever project I wanted to do, and
Angela Pencsak 24:14
and we would go down to the rest so I go to my photography studio during the day. Then we would build the specs on the side, like, and I'm talking big luxury homes, like, well, back then, like a million dollars was a lot of money. And then we would go down to the restaurant at night, and we'd walk in as owners, and we would, like, just then, I would, yeah, Angela
David Pencsak 24:30
would try to give away all our alcohol. She would walk around with trays of mow and go, Hey, try this. I gotta get them hooked. It's called tacos and tequila. So we had over 100 different tequila and
Angela Pencsak 24:42
it was so fun. The restaurant doesn't like lots of fun. And we had this, like, the architect shoe, what's his name? He was so Michael shoe. Michael shoe from Austin, he designed the restaurant. Was like, just amazing. We had this, like, hanging rebar thing. With a glass on it that held 100 tequilas, different tequilas, and we had tequila on top. So anyway, fast forward. The specs were very successful, and we just kept building them. And then we got clients, and then we started getting busy, and then COVID hit.
Mark D. Williams 25:16
So let me just pause you there for a second. So were you building those under your name, or did you start pensack builders,
Angela Pencsak 25:21
builders. We did under pencil builders. We started a name, and
David Pencsak 25:25
that was probably the toughest thing, is to get our brand recognized.
Angela Pencsak 25:29
Oh, yeah, nobody knew us at all, and at least
Mark D. Williams 25:32
not for building. They knew David from restaurant touring. They knew you from photography. They're like, Wait a minute. Now you also build home.
Angela Pencsak 25:39
This day people come up and they'll be like, oh, did you all own that restaurant? Wait, weren't you that photographer? Because, I mean, just the community knew us from from those roles, but yeah, that's true. Yeah. So now, have you had anyone,
Mark D. Williams 25:51
have you had anyone that you've taken baby pictures of that buy a house? Because that would be Yeah.
Angela Pencsak 25:56
And I always say, really, that's going to be yes. And I say that's gonna be my gift to you, is I'll do another session for you, because, like, now I just don't have time. I just did my my my niece's senior pictures. I had to do them. She's my niece. And I'm like, Oh, my God, all this editing was so much work. Now I forgot,
Mark D. Williams 26:12
do you take your own home photos? I do take
Angela Pencsak 26:16
some, but I hire a photographer now because he gets mad that I'm editing too long, and he's like, you have better skill
David Pencsak 26:22
sets, much better place than photography run around, and there's just people that are really good, quite frankly, not charging enough for it, you know what I mean, but it's a reasonable price. So yeah,
Angela Pencsak 26:34
it's just too much time for me. But yes, I can do it. So I'm still trying to, like, win the sub zero wolf Contest, which is, what is the contest? It's like a photo contest of, like, if you have some kitchens, the kitchens
David Pencsak 26:48
and you support, you send that in. It's coming up soon, right? Well,
Angela Pencsak 26:52
I mean, like 17,000 people enter it, or whatever. It's crazy, but that's one of my goals in life. Like, check it off the list.
Mark D. Williams 26:59
Put it why not do a little comedy? Why not get like a get like a house, gonna use a real one. But that probably would you get PETA to go on. You go get like a stuffed animal Wolf, put it in there and open it up, animate a wolf coming out of it. Or speak to the brand, I know,
Angela Pencsak 27:13
I realized in there they don't even like the people that win, that it's not like the appliances don't even stand out. It's just like a moody picture, you know it's like, so, yeah, I think it is. I have new goals this year, and that is one of them.
Mark D. Williams 27:27
Award submissions are hard because it depends on if the judges are in person. That's totally different if they're doing it based on just digital photography. And the write ups are really important. So how you write or how you describe it? So I don't know. Yeah,
Angela Pencsak 27:41
I know. Well, there's chat, G, P, T,
Mark D. Williams 27:45
but that does help. I used to enter, I
Angela Pencsak 27:47
used to enter a photography contest all the time. And I mean, that's how I got my like masters to be a master photographer. I had to win so many of those. So I love the competition. I just love it. And that's why we did pray to homes this last year is the prey to homes is, in a way, it's a competition,
Mark D. Williams 28:05
for sure, it is. It's your brand. It's a brand competition to the public, yeah, and
Angela Pencsak 28:08
so we were just so happy, because all we wanted was People's Choice. We were but we ended up getting best elevation, best interior design, which I'm so excited about. And then judges choice, realtors choice and People's Choice. Oh,
Mark D. Williams 28:25
my, that was, like, a clean sweep. That's like, going to the Oscars and, like, just one film, just taking them all down, hugging
David Pencsak 28:30
my it was weird. We'd be walking off the stage and go the fin size, you need to come back up to your like, okay,
Angela Pencsak 28:36
it was fun. It was so fun. And we're very proud that just happened, like a couple months ago?
Mark D. Williams 28:41
Well, I remember because I called you. That's when I so when we were launching into Texas for the curious builder collective, at this point, it pretty much were you want to work with people in trust that can carry the brand, but also people that have similar values. And a lot of them, I think, actually almost all of them, are contractor coalition alumni. And obviously I thought of you in Texas. You're the only two builders that I know, plus the people that are respect. And I was like, Oh, I've got to call Angela. And you were, I think you were actually prepping that house for the tour. It was like, Yeah. And you're like, I think I didn't even get out, like, three sentences. And you said, yeah, man, that I'm like, I didn't even tell you I don't need it. I was just like, I know enough to know enough. Like, I'm good. She's like, I need to get back to style in this house and get this thing ready to for sale, and what are we doing?
David Pencsak 29:22
No, no, no. It's like, do you were you gonna have a conversation with me about that, that this is something else that you're gonna do?
Angela Pencsak 29:30
No, I just, I'm the manager here. Yeah,
Mark D. Williams 29:32
David, when you when she said, I do, you forfeited a lot of your choices. I think you know that. Yeah, yes. Oh yeah, you know I'm the boss. Yeah, you know what? Speaking of that. So it's funny, David, you'll get probably all men will probably relate to this. So the other I have three little kids. I've got a nine year old, she turns nine here in a couple days, two days, and then a six year old and a five year old. And the other day, Tate, my five year old, I forget, he wanted something, and I said, go ask your mom, or it was something, whatever it was. And he looks at me. He goes, Dad is Mom, your boss. I. And I just lost it laughing. And I was like, That is an interesting question. I said, I Why don't you ask mom if she's the boss, and so my wife's a physician, and so you've got two alpha A's making decisions. And it's so funny because, like, she used to handle all her social media content, and about three months ago, she just said it's just too much between her job and just, probably there's just being at home, it's a lot. And so we hired a company. I've been very happy with it. So anyway, I'm having a my little guy was sick yesterday, so we're having, we're both working from home, and she was doing some charting because Simon was sick. So she had to come home. I had to leave, go to the office. Well, anyway, long story short, I'm having this marketing meeting with my social media team. I have two separate teams, one for Kirsch builder and one for Mark Williams custom homes. And I was making something that from the other the other couch, I heard her say, hey, team, like, you don't have to listen to his ideas. Like, basically. And I was like, Hey, wait a minute. You said you didn't want to do this anymore, but you still want an opinion on what's happening. It was just, it's really funny that I often joke with my male clients. Just don't feel bad I'm the builder, but I don't have a say in my own house, either, and
Angela Pencsak 31:02
I'm sure she actually really liked doing it. It's just that when you have so much going on with kids and another job like sometimes you just have to give it
Mark D. Williams 31:09
up. It was you mentioned it earlier. Angela, creativity, I think one thing that social media does an amazing job is it's an outlet for creativity. The problem is it becomes a machine. So at some point your creativity is not that it's stunted, but if it becomes an obligation, it becomes different difficult. And I've always been a big fan of, like, do what you love and hire out the things that you don't. And I think that's probably hard for you, because now you're hiring out photography, but you also do love it. And so I that was actually, I've
Angela Pencsak 31:36
realized I was really, really sad when I closed my studio, like I it was just, matter of fact, my website is still out there, and it says, like, I need to just shut it off. It says, No, it's
David Pencsak 31:48
great. It should, yeah, she can just keep it up. You said that it's closed, but you have phenomenal
Angela Pencsak 31:54
work on I know. But why do I need to even have that out there? So I'm just like, well, you
Mark D. Williams 31:59
still get leads off of it. I mean, people email you off of it, okay? I just, I had
Angela Pencsak 32:03
a hard time letting it go that career, like I loved it so much, so it took me a long time to like I came over full time with with our company. It took me a while to love this as much as that, but now I do, and now I just wouldn't go back. I love the design aspect. Matter of fact, I love it so much that other builders have asked me to help them with design selections and all that stuff. And people keep asking them, like, what? Yes, I'll do that. So I just recently opened a design firm with a partner and her and I, she's more, she does the furniture part of it, and and she does the interior design too, and she can do all the renderings. And we just have different talents. And so, yeah, so I opened another business. There you go.
Mark D. Williams 32:53
There you go. Serial entrepreneur. How are you handling that? I assume that's your creative outlet. You enjoyed interior
Angela Pencsak 32:58
design. I love it. I mean, I will stay up late at night, and he goes, What are you doing? I'm like, oh, looking at chandeliers. Do you
Mark D. Williams 33:05
feel like for your clients when they come in? Like for architecture? Are you doing that in house? Are you hiring that out?
Angela Pencsak 33:10
No, we hire that out so it's not in house, but we do have one person that we use probably 90% of the time, because she just understands the quality that we like and kind of our specs, and she has a whole list, it's called, like, the pensack Builder list, that she has to go through on the plans. And she's patient. So I like that with the clients, like, if they don't like something, she's like, okay, and yeah.
David Pencsak 33:35
So we just had a client that wanted one style, and that's initially how the plan was working. And then they went to a Parade of Homes and wanted a whole different style. And she's very okay. They're just trying to understand what you want and does it. So it's just, but
Angela Pencsak 33:50
we will go, I mean, we are open to other architects and and, you know, just, we're not saying we wouldn't do that, but we just have one that just what we like,
Mark D. Williams 34:01
what percentage of the homes that you do are spec homes versus build the suit?
Angela Pencsak 34:06
Well, we only do one spec home per, like, maybe year and a half to two years one, yeah. And then we build about, well, we have, like, what seven right now on the pre construction, uh huh, six or seven. So that's it. That's a max. We don't really want to take more than that. How big is your team we have? We're very heavy on the female side right now. Okay, so losing control. We have a team of five, I think so. We have a bookkeeper that's in the office full time. We have, we just hired an interior designer that, and she knows commercial too, and so she's really good. She can her skill set is different than all of ours. She can do renderings and go in rooms and put furniture in and different things. And then we hired our daughter, who just graduated from. Ian, Texas Tech, and she got a business degree, and she was summa cum laude. She's 4.0 student. She's we got her to come work for us, and she's actually an assistant project manager to him, like her. She's very she's good at managing people almost better than me. Yeah, she's gonna take over the company, hopefully one day. Yeah, and then we have another one that this is crazy, so we hired her. She was an interior designer, and her husband got a job in Orlando, so I was so sad. I mean, literally, she'd been working for us for two years, and amazing. And at first we hired her for interior design, but then she kind of was more project management. You know how you hire someone for one thing, but you figure out that their skill set is better in another spot, right? I mean,
Mark D. Williams 35:44
it's kind of like the right the right person in the wrong, wrong seat. Now you just ask you all do
Angela Pencsak 35:50
a little bit of everything. And when you have a small company, yeah, my bookkeeper sometimes is over at a job site cleaning. She's like, I'm gonna go clean the job site. I mean, this is what we just do what you got to do, right for your business? Yeah, and I love that. So when we hire them, we're like, you're a team player. So even though we this is your job duties, you might be doing other things. And so anyway, that's our team. She moved to Orlando, so she works remotely for us. Can you believe I thought maybe it wasn't going to work out? Oh no, she's
David Pencsak 36:20
the punchless drill sergeant man. She will her phone. She's on her phone eight hours a day.
Mark D. Williams 36:27
When? How does she do that? How that? I mean, that's impressive to a certain point, but how does she, how could, does she command respect from the people the trades in the field
Angela Pencsak 36:36
for Well, I mean, ours knew her when she was here. But she schedules them all. So she's like, Hey, we got the cabinet guys coming to this house. We got at this house. We have, you know, that this person coming this day. So, so she puts it all in the calendar. And are you guys using builder trend? Or what are you using for builder trend? She puts in all the change orders in builder trend. It's stuff that she can do remotely. Oh no, for
Mark D. Williams 37:00
sure. That's what's so appealing. It's interesting because we have a lot of clients where, let's say they're gone or out of town, where built trend is really nice. Obviously, as a software as the builder, you could be remote too. I think we're going to start seeing there is a certain point we still need. The fact that she was there for a couple years, obviously gives her a lot of loyalty and a lot of clout with the people. She must have someone, whether it's you guys or your daughter or someone who you know is at the job site, she couldn't unless she flies into town for punch. Like, how would she even know what last week? So, oh, really, she flies in for punch. That's amazing. You
Angela Pencsak 37:30
went to Costa Rica, and we flew her in for a week. That's we were gone in Costa Rica, so we just had,
David Pencsak 37:36
she had the the supervision at the job. She had partial dog care,
Angela Pencsak 37:42
partial dog sitter for us. She just stayed at the house.
Mark D. Williams 37:45
That's amazing. That's amazing because you see one, one advantage that designers and architects have over builders, traditionally, unless you're an owner's rep, is you can work all over the country as a designer and architect. You can fly in a lot of the designers I use like I'm working with. Oh, hold into your design right now Melissa Holland and her team. She actually lives in Colorado, and she comes back to Minnesota one week a month, but she does stuff all over the country, and designers can move right but traditionally, like a builder my because I love the mountains, and I would love to live in the mountains, Montana, Colorado, wherever, after 20 some years in an area, a you have a brand, you have all your people. And sometimes, like my wife, as I mentioned, as a physician, and she had said, Hey, would we ever want to move somewhere? Because as a doctor, she could get a job at any hospital. Yeah, I'm like, Man, I'm sure I could. It would just take. It would take some time to vet all your subs and to restart. And no one's going to know. Mark Williams custom homes in Colorado or wherever else. It's true,
Angela Pencsak 38:42
though. Mark, I feel like no one knew us either for because, even though, I mean custom home building was kind of our second career for both of us, and even though we our first one was in 2012 our business didn't really kick off until 2000 what, 18 or 19? Yeah. So if you think about it, that's only six years ago, and we already he didn't really want to do the prey to homes, I remember, but I feel like that really helped our business so much, doing that. And I go, Hey, we're on the fast track marketing. Because it's like we're new still, but, but we're not new, or that that
David Pencsak 39:21
kind of leads into the you're talking about the parade home. And so one of our so every spec except the last spec that we build, not That's not counting the parade home either sold before or within a month after we built it. So we knew we were building something that was a right fit and better quality in the neighborhood we were building it. So it went pretty quick. As a matter of fact, I've built three homes in my direct neighborhood. They were all owned by other people. I wrote they saw how we built our house. I wrote them and told them I wanted to build there, and they sold me the land. So like right in our neighborhood. So. But this the last spec that we built. Yeah, I got hit, you know, in lumber, on COVID, on that house and a couple other things. And we ended up carrying that house for 16 months. It was 10 grand a month. Oh,
Angela Pencsak 40:14
I have PTSD from that, but that was the only one that happened. Sometimes you gotta it's lessons learned. But you know what? Though we would go? So what
Mark D. Williams 40:23
would you do? What would you do differently? In hindsight, looking at that, I mean, so you held that for 160
David Pencsak 40:28
grand, here's what I think I got from the whole thing is that, and I'm just going to call it a God thing, okay, is stressful, as was. We worked almost every weekend in that house, doing an open house, doing an open house, and we got four builds from being there where no one else was getting any builds.
Angela Pencsak 40:49
Well, I don't know that anyone else isn't getting builds. No, but I mean,
David Pencsak 40:53
I we wouldn't have had the name exposure or had if we'd sold that early, we wouldn't have had that business.
Angela Pencsak 41:00
No, I know. So it was just meant to be that way. And, and I have, I hold my real estate license, so I was able to list the house, you know, and and get real estate business off of it too. It was just all it was all good. We
Mark D. Williams 41:12
didn't know. You've got a we've got a plate company that's defunct. We've got a photography company that we can't let go, but still is out there somewhere. We've got a new interior design company. We've got a building company. You're a mother and, oh, and by the way, you also have your real estate license. So okay, I'm
Angela Pencsak 41:28
also on the board of our builder Association, and also I just signed up to Dave was real excited when I told him. I said, Hey, we're going to build this veteran who His house is falling apart downtown with Operation triage, and our Builders Association, and national Home Builders Association is also involved. And I said I signed us up to be the builder on this house. And they was like, you didn't know it
David Pencsak 41:59
got announced at one of our our meetings, right? And then, and I also, she gets up, she doesn't say anything to me. She just walks up to the front and tells like we're doing it, yeah. Well,
Angela Pencsak 42:10
my dad was a veteran, and he just passed away last year, so I feel like this is our way of giving back and honoring him. And so we did the demolition yesterday, and we're gonna build this. Go check out. We're gonna build this. I wish I had someone to do a whole documentary on it, because it's just gonna be so cool. We're gonna try to build it in like four months.
Mark D. Williams 42:36
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Angela Pencsak 43:34
but we, and that's where these vendor relationships come in so handy, because we're so loyal to our vendors. And we went to our vendors and asked them for the donation to, I mean, we have Anderson window, gave us all the windows, yes. And then builders, first source is giving us doors. We got Cambria giving us stuff. We have answer. Tile, of course, you know, so yes. And then Reese Kitchen and Bath, they gave all the appliances and everything our jobs to help work. James Hardie, collect it all. Yeah, just these. And these are vendors that we use and love and are part of CBSA. And that's, that's where all that really comes in handy. And they couldn't believe that we got all these donations. I think a bit, I think a big
Mark D. Williams 44:19
part of it is simple. You have to ask, yeah, and I know that sounds super oversimplified. I think when you were doing something with a joy collaborative, I had Mark Ostrom on the podcast a year ago, and he in Minnesota. It's a nonprofit that helps children in Minnesota with life limiting disabilities. And we he just said he's in a small group, networking group of mine. And obviously, when you hear him talk about 66,000 kids in need, you get goosebumps on your arm and you're like, I'm going to quit my job and go work for this because there's something about children that just, you'd have to be a stone not to be moved by it. And as a dad of three like, you're especially susceptible to my emotions around children, just because you just, you feel that. Goal and wanting to help people, and when we when? So we said, hey, we'll do an event at one of our homes. And then I asked our trade base, I was blown away at how many that was our first foray into sort of charity work locally. And I just sometimes, and this is just my own thing, but you read the paper, and there's all these terrible things that are happening the world, and it's hard to know sometimes, as you're you're eating a breakfast or eat healthy. It's just hard to know how to balance some of this stuff out. And I don't know the answer. This wasn't meant to be maybe coming out, but just comes out now thinking about charity work, because all you can do is really be involved in your local community and try to I don't know, for me personally, I'm like, I can't solve hunger in Africa, nor do I feel personally called for that. I certainly am glad that people, some people do feel called to do that, but I can do something in my local community. It's just somebody I know, and I it was really empowering to see these, my painter, my cabinet shop. It wasn't huge. Maybe it was 500 bucks or $1,000 or honestly, it was just maybe them being there. And I was really, really moved by the people that felt moved to sort of show up and support, and we threw a really big event of 6070, people all there to try to help raise money. And just, I don't know, I was just really impressed at people that spearhead that, and you guys should be commended for that, for sure. And anyone that's in the I feel like homes, especially because we're in the home building business, we I've spent a lot of time talking about this recently, but I'll ask you the question, David, what was the address of the home you grew up in?
David Pencsak 46:26
Ooh, you realize I'm old now, or
Mark D. Williams 46:29
no, but can you pull it off the top of your head? Or no,
Angela Pencsak 46:35
I can't, because I was a military Brad, I think I moved times. I moved a lot. Oh, yeah, we lived in
David Pencsak 46:41
Germany. I know the street name, but not the address.
Mark D. Williams 46:43
That's fine. What was the street name? Low
David Pencsak 46:46
water, Lexington, Kentucky. And so where
Mark D. Williams 46:49
I'm going with this is that a home building is really emotional, and a lot of us shape our lives there, unless you're Angela, and they move every two years all across the world, and then it's, you know, that becomes a little bit different. But I guess my point in bringing that up is that I think people, the reason it resonates with charity work is people realize that people have a home that they need to live in. They can relate to it because they have a home they're raising their family. And so I just, I love how active home builders are in their community. And I just, I feel like I just want to celebrate them for the work that they do.
Angela Pencsak 47:19
So weird that you just brought that up because I had a dream last night. I was like, what if I went back to every house I ever lived on and photographed it and then made a coffee table book? That'd be so cool. Yeah?
Mark D. Williams 47:29
I mean, and think of one thing that we have to hire someone else. Yeah? Now, yeah, you can't. You can't do the photography yourself. Or you can put a baby in each photo, in the bushes. You could do like, hey, I need, I need 100 babies, because I need to put these babies in the front bushes and then take a picture, and then I stick a white plate somewhere. Oh, god, yeah, yeah, you'll, for sure, be in the paper, but probably for wrong reasons. Dave and I'll have to come Bailey out and realize, hey, this is for good reason. She's not stealing babies here while we went off the rails on this one. I know that's that's the entertainment side. You come for the curious builder, but you might stay for a curious story. What, what is your one thing I actually really appreciate on your website is most of us, and that was something I talked a lot about at the contractor coalition, was pre construction agreements. And what was interesting about your website is you actually disclosed what it is. 15,000 looks like. It's just a flat fee. And I was just curious how you a came up to that number B. What people say about it? I've just been impressed at how clear your mission statement. People don't have any questions. Hey, it's 15,000 they're gonna help me. I assume that doesn't include architecture or plan drawing, but that is obviously it looks like interior design selections based on what I read. Yeah,
Angela Pencsak 48:37
it does include some. We don't get into super details, because we will just come up with allowances for some of them. Sure. Obviously, I'm not going to go to every towel store and design every single bathroom before we before we know for getting a contract
Mark D. Williams 48:50
that would just be a waste. You're just, you're basically just shaping it. And so, yeah,
Angela Pencsak 48:54
yeah, we just work so hard and we put so much time and hours. I mean, gosh, I'd love to just add up the hours you use in pre construction. I think it is foolish for any builder to just price out a home and do all that work for free, like you just, it's, it's just too much if you're doing it accurately, and you're really actually getting a price for a home, you know, I mean, not
Mark D. Williams 49:21
just estimating, yeah, I think it's, don't you think it's also helps you identify your ideal client right away, too, because I remember, I've probably been doing a pre construction agreement way before I knew that's what it was called, and I it was much smaller amount than that. Now I use a 10,000 flat fee, but then I list out other services, survey work. Maybe I'll capture interior design. I don't have anything in house, so I might work with a interior designer, but then capture them in but it's similar to you. It's shaping what the budget will be to spend if they're not willing to spend 15,000 on a two, $3 million bill, that it tells me a little bit like this is probably either A, someone that can't afford what we do, or B, someone maybe I don't want to work with, because if they're not willing to put a little money into design, they
Angela Pencsak 49:58
literally don't blink about. It, they are fine with it. And then we do know we have the right client, because they have to put a little investment in as well. We have,
David Pencsak 50:07
in addition to the 15,000 which is a non refundable amount to us, and then they will pay the architect directly. They'll own the plan, so they pay for but we go to every meeting with them in that design process, sometimes, sometimes it's direct, so that we're we fully understand the project, which allows us to it really
Angela Pencsak 50:30
helps too, because sometimes architects will as they'll overdraw a house, and then the person is, oh, wait, like, I can't afford this house, so we have to keep all that under control in realizing what the budget is. And people are like, Oh, how much are you a square foot? Well, I don't know. Do you have 50 windows? Do you have 100 windows? Like, it's also custom. And so during those design meetings, we can keep that under control. Like, I already know, hey, if you're gonna get that 10 foot by 20 foot slider, that's gonna cost 30 grand. You know, yeah. I
Mark D. Williams 51:02
mean, I use it as a selling like a positive selling tool, that by doing this, you are engaging us to be with you over the next four to six months, or however long it takes to really be there as a your concierge, your hospitality. We help them a lot of times, people come to Minnesota, it's just, I think it might be we have the oldest Parade of Homes in the country. I think Rhett said we just celebrated our 75th anniversary. And so it's just in the DNA that a lot of people go to builders first, which is obviously good for us. We're builders, but not that they don't go to architects and designers, but predominantly it's through the builders first. And so I usually will say, if you're not working with an architect, here's two or three I think would align based on your budget, based on your style, based on who we really think is going to be the best fit, based on I usually will meet with them, obviously, first get them under a pre construction agreement, and at that point, we're basically being their
Angela Pencsak 51:51
advocate. And actually, I think it saves them money doing that, because you're going to make less mistakes. We're going to really have our eyes on that plan, making sure that every door swing is the right way, that you know where a pocket door needs to be, all these things that you know, we help them through, that I just feel like it ends up being so much better than just someone coming to us with plans. Like, here I have plans. And like, can you build this? It
Mark D. Williams 52:18
also takes the you guys are very you can just tell in the way you talk, you care deeply and you enjoy what you do. But we're very relationship driven people, and so I think it becomes difficult if you are just bidding a plan, you're just a number like, I'm not honestly, I'm just not sure. There are certain times where I really want to work with that architect, or it's a it fits a need that I want, and it's not that I can't create a relationship, but you're taking my greatest I feel like you're taking my greatest asset away, and you're saying, my greatest asset is, let's say people, connection and people skills and understanding, like what it is you're trying to create the experience you're trying to because it's not, I mean, the house needs to be able to stand on its own. What is the we don't probably spend enough time as builders talking about the experience. We often say, hey, I can build this house for whatever per foot, or this is the art. But what about the experience? So what about that's
Angela Pencsak 53:05
my thing too, because we were both in kind of a hospitality business before, so experience is very important to us. And we're, we are people pleasers, you know, and and so I try to make it like when we go to our Cabinet appointments, I'll bring a charcuterie board with me and a bottle of wine. Oh, I like that. The owner of my cabinet, he'll take them on a tour. And the other day, my cabinet maker goes, you know, you're the only one that does this, right? And I was like, oh, we'll see. I because I love this. I want it to be fun. The whole process should be fun for them. It can't be just all about the money all the time. And just, do you remember?
Mark D. Williams 53:43
What do you remember? What Brad said when we were at Nashville. He said some of his stuff in Arizona takes 234, years long, so, but he's like, every six months he would take his clients out for dinner, not talking about the job. And it was he said, It humorously, like the goal is people don't sue people that they have dinner with. I was just a little bit of a twinkle in his eye kind of thing. But
Angela Pencsak 54:02
you become friends with
Mark D. Williams 54:03
them, you really do, yeah, but, but when it's people to people, if they're we just had an issue the other day where the homeowner called me. They were frustrated. In person, they're the nicest people, and on the phone, you got this distance. It allows them to be a little tougher in their talk. And it wasn't a super great conversation, but you got to work through it. And the idea is that when you are in when you're person to person and people, most people just don't have it in them to just grind someone else to dust. And so do you have that
Angela Pencsak 54:32
little happy face map thing that goes up and down during the build? Oh, the emotional roller coaster? Yes, I think that should be in the contract.
Mark D. Williams 54:38
What do you mean by happy face? There you have, like, a happy face on your roller coaster.
Angela Pencsak 54:43
They're happy at the beginning when slabs getting poured, and then by the time we're in, like, like the, you know, rough in and it takes, like, months, they're like, Hey, why is anything happening? We you know, it's
Mark D. Williams 54:53
interesting. We met about a year ago. We started mapping out the client experience, and it sort of stalled with some of our other initiatives. I have. All mapped out the emotional roller coaster. They shared that with us, and we've done some work on it as well. Part of it is implementing it into our month like I have an idea of what I want. My team, my project coordinator, we actually just hired someone about a month ago, so maybe I'll have Angie as her name, start monitoring that. But once a month, we would ask the client for a rating on a scale from one to 10. And Nick Schifrin actually talked about this, that if it was a nine or a 10, it would invoke no action for him. I think it was like a seven or eight. The pm called them anything below a seven, like, he called the client immediately, and like, their standard was, it has to be, if you are giving us anything below seven or eight, like, something is wrong. Like, we want nines and 10s. It's a little bit kind of like when you ask people for five star reviews, and if they don't give it you one, you want to say, well, what is preventing you before you rate it like, before you're rating us a five like, let us know what we need to do to be a five and like that is, honestly, that's preemptive hospitality that is opening the door for saying, Hey, we're
Angela Pencsak 55:55
looking for a build and your client is not frustrated at some point over something.
Mark D. Williams 56:00
No, they're always going to get frustrated, don't you use that line. I usually tell
Angela Pencsak 56:05
them that in the beginning, at one point, you're going to be frustrated at something, but it's okay, as long as they can tell us and we are going to fix or make it right. That's all that matters, really
Mark D. Williams 56:15
well. I usually kind of humor says, I said, at some point during this build, someone's going to cry. Now it might be tears of joy and it might be tears of anguish, but someone sure shooting is going to cry at this. And like, you kind of say it funny, right? Or like, Hey, I'm never going to build again, you know, right? And like, the only other one that I try to combat a lot is when people always say, That's how many times you heard someone say, This is my forever house, Oh, yeah. And I, honestly, I this is just my me and my soapbox here, but I can't stand that saying. And sometimes, depending on who the client is, I'll sometimes say not your forever house is a coffin. And this idea in what I'm trying to combat is not their sentimentality, because I'm fine with them saying that I'm fine with dream home. What I don't like about forever home is we don't know what's going to happen our life. We don't know if we're going to get paralyzed or have a life limiting condition or getting a little serious but that is true. And so again, you got to read the room. And I don't always come off quite this crass or not crass, but just like, straight to the point, but I try to, like to remind them, like, I'm trying to, I'm trying to prevent them from thinking like this is perfect, like, if anyone ever says we are drilling a perfect house, or that's like a red flag and a blaring horn in my face, because we're building a one of a kind, house outside, in the emblem, in the elements, rain, snow, shine, cold, humidity. Working with 1000 different people, expectations that we're held to and that we hold ourselves to is very, very high, and so you have
Angela Pencsak 57:33
to tell these Well, tell clients like people make mistakes. That's one of the biggest things that I struggle with is that clients have to understand that people make mistakes. Like, I mean, my, my poor trim guy, he was hanging a mirror the other day, and it was a big, giant mirror, and he just accidentally, like, hit it down on the ground too hard, and the whole thing shattered, shattered. We have to buy another mirror. And I felt bad because I didn't really. I he needed to pay for it in a way, but also I felt bad because it was just a mistake. So for me, I'm going, Hey, these are the kind of mistakes that happen in life. Let's all just be a team together. Let's figure it out. No pointing fingers at one sub that they did this and they did that. That's
Mark D. Williams 58:18
I heard a quote recently. I forget who said it. And it was like, Don't bring me problems. Bring me solutions. Yeah, and I like that. I mean, I like that a lot. Yes.
Angela Pencsak 58:28
I like, that's, that's our whole team is very solution based. We're like, okay, so this happened, like, what's the solution? Let's like, figure it out.
Mark D. Williams 58:36
So it's funny. Well, I wanna respect your time. We're at an hour in the audience's time as well, and we owe that easy. Yeah, David didn't even get to talk about his 15 other businesses. What is give me maybe one thing? What are you excited for here for the rest of the year? What are some, maybe one thing out there that you're really excited about? I'm,
David Pencsak 58:55
I'm excited about the veteran home doing that. That's, that's a really fun, rewarding thing to do. We'll soon start planning for the 2027,
Angela Pencsak 59:07
parade. We're gonna do this again. And so we're, like, challenging ourselves, because I was so in love with that other house, and I'm like, How can we make this better? Like, but that's such a cool challenge to have.
Mark D. Williams 59:21
So was it a lot? What made that one such a successful book? Because you sold that it went into the parade unsold and sold the first weekend? Or what was the story
Angela Pencsak 59:28
on that? No, I didn't even put on the market till a month after, because I wanted to use it as kind of a model, like just I wasn't. I knew it was. I think we were scared to sell it fast, because it was I really didn't want getting us so much business. And just like, it was kind of our model home. So I think we had the parade in November, beginning November, I don't think I put it on the market till sometime in December, and then we sold it in March. So
Mark D. Williams 59:55
So you were able to hold on to it for a few months, so you just sold it. Oh, and. Now
Angela Pencsak 1:00:00
we have a concierge service because we're actually managing the house and the house they bought the house next door, so we're managing that for them, and because they're not here full time, it's like a second house. So second houses, yeah, yeah, both. So we're managing that as a concierge service, and we will have a car for them at the airport when they come. And we will have manage the pool and the yard and all that stuff. So that
Mark D. Williams 1:00:26
sounds great. Well, we'll have everything in the show notes, all your contact, your Instagram handles, everything like that. And then for anyone in Texas near you guys that want to be part of the curious builder collective, you can go to just curious builder.com and under collectives, you can go to Texas, and you can get signed up there, and you guys can get together a couple times a year, yeah, pick each other's brains and elevate and I'm hoping, actually, I haven't told you this, I'm coming down to, I think I'm going to Houston. How far away is Houston from you guys? Three hours. Okay, I'm coming down there in July for a conference that they're gonna have me speak at. And so trend is having me go down there, and it's kind of fun, because that's something we can come to? Yeah, well, for sure you can, yeah, it's open. I think it's, I'll look at the I don't have it off the top my head, the name of the conference, it's but I get to talk about wellness, which I'm really excited about. So, you know, Sonic camp, and boot camp. Boot Camp is going to be happening here in May, out in Zion National Park. For those that haven't heard about it's on the website, but essentially it's, how do we get builders away from their phones? And it's three days out in Zion National Park. We're kind of, it's a glamping situation. There's this relief place called under canvas that's amazing right outside the park. And it's basically three days no phones, and you're just with other business owners, you know, doing long hikes, doing some workouts and just
Angela Pencsak 1:01:35
so many things, too. Mark, I don't know how you do all that. Well,
Mark D. Williams 1:01:39
I was gonna you have way more businesses than I do. So,
Angela Pencsak 1:01:43
yeah, the white plate
Mark D. Williams 1:01:44
company. I like that. If does that website still exists? No,
David Pencsak 1:01:48
come on, what was the white plate? No, but Angela and portraits does. Oh,
Mark D. Williams 1:01:52
God, we might have, we might have to put that one on the website.
David Pencsak 1:01:56
Just portraits.com
Mark D. Williams 1:01:59
Let's blow that one amazing and
David Pencsak 1:02:02
I, you know, I did get her to end up she and she got really good at it. So you'll see some of the food photography on there of what we served and stuff.
Angela Pencsak 1:02:08
Check it out. I was all about photographing the food, then you get to eat
Mark D. Williams 1:02:11
it. That's good point. I like that. Well, thanks again for coming on the cares Bill podcast, and we'll see you guys soon.
Angela Pencsak 1:02:17
Yeah, thanks for inviting us. This is great. We miss you, Mark. We got a whole hour of your time.
Mark D. Williams 1:02:24
It is nice when Everyone's so busy, it is hard to get people that's it's funny you say that Angela one of the things that, and maybe this is like anything, when you schedule it, you have the time, right? And I think one thing that's nice about the podcast is it does force you to turn off your phone, to respect, obviously, the people that you're interviewing time, but it actually, I find it calming because you're just one on one having a nice conversation with somebody, and I just feel like, like I don't even know what's happening. We all it's three minutes from now, we'll open up our phone and see, like any other business owner, all the things that are happening. But it is nice to have that time of quiet,
Angela Pencsak 1:02:53
I know. Well, invite us back. We'll be sure. Well, all right, thanks. Thanks
Mark D. Williams 1:02:57
for coming on. Okay, thanks for tuning in to curious builder podcast. If you like this episode, do us a favor. Share it with three other business owners. The best way that we can spread what we're doing is by word of mouth, and with your help, we can continue to help other curious builders expand their business. Please share it with your friends. Like and review online, and thanks again for tuning in. You.
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